coyote and red fox urine ?

[tonymalone]

for Tim, Bob, and any other quality urine collectors.

i know, after feeding yotes nothing but red meat for a couple of weeks, kidneys slow way down, they cut back on amount of water drunk, and urine cuts waaay back, i have seen this, but what i want to know is, what if anything, you can supplement thier diet w/ to prevent this, and still have quality urine, or do ya have to swap em out w/ fresh yotes, well not really to concerned about yotes, cause i get plenty fresh ones regularly, but i do not get plenty of fresh red fox. how do ya keep them reds peeing good pee?

[bobwendt]

whole muskrat and rabbits where they can get guts, bone, fur etc helps and pee quality stays up, but volume stays about 1/2 even with that after a time. but still better than the 1/10th on staight red meat. here we can`t get whole rats or rabbits and they are worth their weight in gold. there is a reason yellow pellot fed pee is $12 a gallon and the good stuff $35-50. with the loss of live sales here and no switch out opportunity, I imaguine most pee collectors here will go out of biz, or cut producton a lot.

[tonymalone]

thanks, Bob, one reason for asking, is most all of the pen owners, feed thier running dogs a meatbased dog food instead of a meal based food, like other dog owners do.
a few years ago i fed meal based dog food to yotes in a communal pen, talk about a mess, LOL it will scour them, which makes for a h#ll of a nasty pen to go in and get yotes. then i fed this meatbased food to yotes, and it didn't scour them, it made lttle hard black turds, similar to those in the wild,
was wondering how much it would hurt the urine quality, to feed some of this type feed, as opposed to the meal based feed, to get them what they need, to keep them peeing.
say maybe feed it 1 day a week.

[Tim Rose]

I think the wallmart brand canned dog food 'may" be okay for good pee, but have never tried it, i fed it to the pup yotes in the summer but wasn't collecting......I never read the back ingredients, but if it is high in grains i would stay away from it,
but if made from animal parts, etc...it could be okay.

Bad thing is store bought is 'store bought' and cost $............Bob & I deal in mostly free food........deer carcusses, beaver, pig, etc (as you probably do tony).......helps keep the overhead down. I sometimes start buying some muskrasts at the end of season from a guy or 2...but is a loosing deal for all the work.

Chickens can be raised easy and if let free range don't cost much...but if feeding to the yotes the clean up sucks.....a feather exploshion in the cages...lol

[Tim Rose]

I think rotation is the key for high production levels as both you and bob know.........

[tonymalone]

yea , on the yotes rotation is not a problem,
was really kinda wanting to aquire about a 1/2 doz. red fox, and rotation becomes a prob. there. lucky to just get a cage full.
might should start freezeing fresh road kill rabbits, and squirrells, to supplement red meat with, thanks yall.

[bobwendt]

you can hardly save enough from the road. a fox wil eat a whole rat a day. a coyote 3 whole rats a day. or the equivalent. we are set up to collect off 64 red fox and 48 coyotes, that is same as 208 rats a day, or 200 lb red meat. I don`t even know why I do it. just no way anymore without the 3 week rotation on animals. our indiana dnr belongs in jail imo. arshole jail. they have and are costing hoosiers a lot of money and a lot of unneccesary coyote damage ,and also untold cruelty to coyotes. you want to see an animal abused, just make it worthless.